I'm a Lancia owner now. AMA.

"duurtlang" (duurtlang) 09/02/2016 at 12:29 • Filed to: Lancia, Zeta, Lancia Zeta, motor swap, peugeot 205 cti

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Yesterday I bought my first Lancia. It costs about the same as two nights in a cheap Boston hotel. The Lancia is a piece of shit. A POS with a great engine. I regret nothing.

It’s a 1996 Lancia Zeta minivan with a 2.0 liter turbo engine from Peugeot/Citroën. It has a 5 speed manual and there are 206k km on the odometer.

The bad:

Rust

Passenger side rear view mirror has been lost (but the driver one folds electrically!)

Clutch is bad

AC doesn’t work: pump doesn’t start.

Timing belt replaced in 2003 at 86k km (206k now)

4 out of 6 seats are not mounted but simply littered around.

No radio

RUST!

front tires have lots of cracks due to age.

No valid inspection, and with that rust it’ll never pass.

Interior plastics missing.

Driver side key lock broken, remote without function. To lock the car you use the passenger door.

Leather on the steering wheel ripped.

Engine hoses fixed with tape.

Probably lots more.

The good:

The PSA (Peugeot/Citroën) engine. It’s a 2.0 turbo (gasoline) and it runs smoothly.

The back actually looks quite decent. For a minivan. Americans, note the almost mandatory tow hook.

I spot two exhaust tips. Looking back at these pictures it’s the first time I’ve noticed those.

Weight reduction

Fancy Alcantara seats...

... Alcantara seats everywhere! And yes, when I went to look at the car the interior looked like this.

I could throw my bicycle in there quite easily. That’s a plus.

For some reason this car was imported from Germany in 2o12. Why, I will never know. The signs are still there. Besides the license plate holders and some stickers there’s also the German language Lancia Zeta Peugeot 806 user manual in the glovebox. Sadly that user manual, combined with 1 ignition key, is the only thing I got with the car.

Top speed should be limited to 190 km/h (118 mph) due to the limitation of the Hankook tires. There are no Hankook tires on the car.

Nice! Well maintained!

Yes, there’s an Abarth sticker there.

What it’s all about.

The car was offered at a very shady place. The median price of the cars they offer for sale is about €1k. The guy had to move 4 cars before we were able to get to the Lancia. One of those for needed to be jump started.

When the guy had moved 1 car already. The Lancia is in the back, in the corner. Other than the Citroën all these cars were rather shitty.

I noticed that the Lancia actually drives quite decently. Especially when you take condition into consideration. It was close to be on par with the 6k miles 2016 Chevy Impala Limited I rented this July when I was in the US, although the 1996 Lancia seemed more modern and had better materials.

In the end I ended up paying €450. Which is too much for what is essentially a junker. It’s just that this engine has become rare-ish, and I simply wanted it.

Relevant:

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

My 1987 Peugeot 205 CTi would like to formally thank the Lancia for its kind donation.

Flavien Vidal > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 20:30

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Why? Why? Why? :)

duurtlang > Flavien Vidal 09/01/2016 at 20:33

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You don’t approve of replacing the utterly worn XU5J with this XU10J2TE?

Goggles Pizzano > Flavien Vidal 09/01/2016 at 20:35

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Awesome in a “It was free!” kind of way. That...,and a large ramp. :-)x

Spridget > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 20:38

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You know how to Oppo.

Probenja > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 20:41

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So you bought the least Lancia there is that someone wanted to make it an Abarth but it’s actually a Peugeot.

At least it has some nice looking wheels that remind me of these:

Actually, on a second look they look nothing alike.

Flavien Vidal > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 20:42

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Hell no! A 205 GTI without its throttle response is not a 205 GTI anymore. Rebuild or nothing :)

duurtlang > Flavien Vidal 09/01/2016 at 20:44

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But it’s a CTi. It’s a convertible, a cruiser. I wouldn’t dream of doing a swap like this in my GTi. Luckily the engine in my GTi is very healthy.

Flavien Vidal > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 20:48

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More acceptable then indeed :)

But PSA turbo engines are not my thing to be honest so :)

Hot Takes Salesman > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 20:50

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A POS with a great engine.

I think that applies to like 70% of all Italian cars.

duurtlang > Flavien Vidal 09/01/2016 at 20:56

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I was either this or the engine from a 306 GTi/Xsara VTS. Getting a nice condition 205 GTi engine is hard (pricey), and you’ll get less power.

I’m keeping my GTi as stock as possible though. Excluding modern tires and some kind of modern radio it couldn’t be more stock actually. I retained the 14" pepperpot wheels. The CTi will to be as stock as possible, with the exception of that engine. The Remus shouty exhaust has been binned and replaced by a mundane stock one, the seats will be reupholstered as close to stock as possible (colored fabric retained/worn black fabric replaced, bolsters repaired), no lowering springs. It’ll be a wolf in wolf cub’s clothing.

Steve in Manhattan > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 20:59

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It’s a ... gamble. Initially I thought those wheels weren’t stock, but it appears that they are. Interested to read the tale of how you get it such that everything works.

RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 21:09

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So the engine has 206,000kms on it as well? Sounds like it will need a healthy service before being pressed into CTi service! :)

My citroen won't start > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 21:10

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PSA/FIAT Minifrankenvan!

When I was born my mother had burgundy 2.0T Citroen Evasion, she still considers it the best car she ever had (she’s still driving that S500).

TheTurbochargedSquirrel > Steve in Manhattan 09/01/2016 at 21:15

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I don’t think it is ever going to be working 100%. At least not after the engine is donated to duurtlang’s 205 CTi.

duurtlang > RallyDarkstrike - Fan of 2-cyl FIATs, Eastern Bloc & Kei cars 09/01/2016 at 21:19

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It’ll get belts, wp, some hoses and obviously filters/fluids/plugs.

206k km isn’t overly much for these. They don’t tend to be hooned to death like 205 GTi and CTi engines.

Amoore100 > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 21:57

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Swap in a Fiat turbo-5 after you pull the PSA engine then have a semi-fast parts runner?

someassemblyrequired > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 22:00

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450 euro for a decent motor and 6 alacantra garage chairs? Seems like a deal - is there some catch where you have to pay for scrappage in the Netherlands? Surprised a dealer would bother keeping it around.

Steve in Manhattan > TheTurbochargedSquirrel 09/01/2016 at 22:05

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We live in hope ...

Leadbull > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 22:10

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That is delightfully awful.

Will you thoroughly hoon it before ripping the engine out?

Chasaboo > duurtlang 09/01/2016 at 22:43

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You got style bro.

duurtlang > Amoore100 09/02/2016 at 02:33

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This thing is really shitty. If we were to entertain the thought that I would want to save it, it would probably need a lot work just to get it past inspection. And that’s ignoring cost/work related to that 5 pot. That rust alone would worry me a lot had I not bought it as a donor, that doesn’t seem even close to legal.

duurtlang > someassemblyrequired 09/02/2016 at 02:36

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Cost of scrappage depends on demand. It will probably cost and bring €0 when brought to a junker. There’s no demand for parts for a vehicle like this. Especially without engine.

duurtlang > Leadbull 09/02/2016 at 02:42

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It is not street legal, due to the lapsed inspection. Getting a new inspection would be impossible from an economic point of view.

Yesterday, the day I bought it, was a bit of a grey zone. I used that day to drive it around and bring it to the place where we’ll pull the engine. I then suspended the registration (saves me from the lack of inspection fine and the €80 or whatever monthly ownership tax) and never insured it.

duurtlang > My citroen won't start 09/02/2016 at 02:44

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What did she like about the van?

Amoore100 > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 02:46

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I’m surprised, then, that the engine is in such good nick! I would have expected it to be vice versa, good body bad engine as is usually the case in the US, but I guess you guys have more cheap runners over there.

duurtlang > Amoore100 09/02/2016 at 02:52

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The engine is rather stout. Given the age of the timing belt and the hose repaired with tape it’s clear there hasn’t been that much money put in it. The oil filter seemed newish though, and the oil itself had a healthy color.

We do have these safety inspections here. This van would never pass with that rust. It’s been economically totalled, as they say.

FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 03:17

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At least the 605 didn’t have to be the donor and the Zeta can die a noble death with it’s heart living on. If I had bought the Lancia I’d keep the seats for some reason.

BvdV - The Dutch Engineer > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 03:17

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Does it have those license plate frame mounted parking sensors on the back? They probably don’t work either, right?

duurtlang > BvdV - The Dutch Engineer 09/02/2016 at 03:21

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Yes it does seem to have those. When you put it in reverse there’s one Beeb. And then that’s it. No more beeping when parallel parking, sadly.

Are you familiar with these vans?

duurtlang > FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem 09/02/2016 at 03:22

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Well, you can have them. They’re about 2 km from the German border. Go to Haren (ems), hop over the border and you’re there. Roughly.

BvdV - The Dutch Engineer > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 03:23

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Nope, just familiar with random aftermarket Halfords stuff.

FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 03:43

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I’d be on my way right now if I had the space, appartment live you know..

duurtlang > FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem 09/02/2016 at 03:58

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Oh I know. I’m an apartment dweller myself.

duurtlang > BvdV - The Dutch Engineer 09/02/2016 at 03:59

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It’s aftermarket? They looked shitty, so I thought they were original Lancia parts :)

BvdV - The Dutch Engineer > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 04:51

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I’m not certain, but the fact that they don’t seem to allign, suggests aftermarket to me. Or Lancia was even shittier than I thought...

Cé hé sin > someassemblyrequired 09/02/2016 at 05:19

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The costs of disposing of the various nasties from a scrap car in an environmentally friendly manner tend to balance out with its scrap value if it’s old and unwanted as this.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 08:34

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I don’t see why you bought this when there’s a perfectly good Toyota there.

duurtlang > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 09/02/2016 at 08:37

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Yes, why not put a Starlet engine in my fun car. That would be an improvement.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 08:46

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I was thinking just move the Starlet engine to the back of the Starlet, but I want to see all of the econoboxes with a drivetrain move.

spanfucker retire bitch > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 08:50

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How much extra were the spider webs?

OPPOsaurus WRX > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 08:59

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which cheap boston hotel are you basing your pricing off of?

duurtlang > OPPOsaurus WRX 09/02/2016 at 09:10

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My experience in trying to find a cheap hotel in Boston for last July. I couldn’t really find any for less than $200/month. The car was €450.

duurtlang > spanfucker retire bitch 09/02/2016 at 09:11

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They increase structural integrity. I bet they contributed to about 20% of the price.

duurtlang > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 09/02/2016 at 09:13

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Why not twin-motor shitboxes? Leave the Starlet engine in place and mount the entire drivetrain of the Skoda next to it in the back of the Starlet, powering the rear wheels.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 09:19

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I can get down with that. You can probably fit something massive in the back of the Lancia. Jaguar V12s are cheap.

duurtlang > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 09/02/2016 at 09:22

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You can fit multiple V12s in there. It’s a minivan! One V12 per wheel seems reasonable. If the one on the right fails you’d still have a left-rear-wheel drive car. I wonder in which classes you could race a car like that.

OPPOsaurus WRX > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 09:23

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yea boston isn;t cheap. where did you end up staying

Textured Soy Protein > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 09:24

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You’re lying, there’s no such thing as a cheap Boston hotel!

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 09:24

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I don’t know about your Yurup style racing, but here you’d want it all going to the right wheel.

duurtlang > OPPOsaurus WRX 09/02/2016 at 09:28

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Airbnb. Somerville (west), close to Harvard.

someassemblyrequired > Cé hé sin 09/02/2016 at 12:16

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Yeah that’s true in North America for the most part as well. Just surprised a dealer would even take up space with something like that unless it would cost them a few hundred euro to have it scrapped.

duurtlang > someassemblyrequired 09/02/2016 at 14:25

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Dealer is not the best word here. This guy has a lot with beaters parked literally bumper to bumper. He does absolutely nothing to the cars, as long as they keep running. I bet he buys the lowest priced cars for €100-200 or so, surplus trade ins at slightly more respectable places. Sell one a day, deduct some costs for the rundown location and you’ve got a normal low income wage. The guy running the place seemed to have been last in line when they were handing out the genetic material for good looks and high IQ.

Here’s a link to all the cars he offers .

Below is the first picture I shot from my Lancia, this was before I even started it. It had a fence directly behind the hatch and on the drivers side. Note how close the cars are parked together.

Pabuuu, JDM car enthusiast & Italian parts hoarder > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 16:31

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Oh man I really like those Lancia phedra/Citroen C8 cars. What are your plans for it ?

Im planning to buy a junky W210 next summer as a beater car, excited as to what your plans are.

duurtlang > Pabuuu, JDM car enthusiast & Italian parts hoarder 09/02/2016 at 16:35

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My plans with the van? Well, I’ll rip out the engine and use it in my 205 CTi. The rest, I’ve listed it on Marktplaats as a parts donor. Whatever doesn’t sell and I can’t use as spare parts for one of my 205s (or 406?) will end up on the scrap heap.

Interested in certain parts?

What are your plans with a W210? Wegenbelasting isn’t going to be cheap, so simply having it around might not be the best idea.

Pabuuu, JDM car enthusiast & Italian parts hoarder > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 17:08

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My plans are to buy one that runs, drives and has APK for a little while. Wegenbelasting is about 225 per 3 months, and im not planning on keeping it longer than that. (maybe I will if I like it that much)

But I was just going to use it as a car to learn on. They all have rust issues, so I can practice all I want. From what I’ve read, mechanically they appear to be quite solid and if there is a problem, there is a lot of info on the internet about them.

Basically I’m leaning towards making it a weird kind of road-warrior thing, Lower it (yeah, the cheap way), cut and straight pipe exhaust and maybe gut interior,. Just basically experiment and learn on this car. leaning towards the e280, I just love the look of them. Lots of ideas, not all of them fully legal.

I still think of the W210 as like a luxury car, and I’m interested to see how a beaten one holds up after so many years. Plus its fun because its way more car than I could ever need at this time.

duurtlang > Pabuuu, JDM car enthusiast & Italian parts hoarder 09/02/2016 at 17:44

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So a rolling wrenching project that you will junk once the APK comes around?

If you want to keep it just a little longer, can I make a suggestion? It will cost you some hassle. Import one with a fresh TÜV from Germany. The benefit is that you’ll have (close to) 2 years of APK, and when it’s 17 years or so old the import tax discount is 100% (so €0). When I imported my E30 Touring the import bureaucracy itself (unrelated to tax) was maybe €130.

Import tax calculator:

http://www.autoweek.nl/bpmcalculator

RT > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 17:55

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I remember someone had the Citroën version of that before. Nothing special but as you said, the engine is nice. Beats a 2016 Impala any day.

Have you made any plans on how you’re going to perform the engine donation and set it up?

someassemblyrequired > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 18:27

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Oh man I finally got a chance to look at the inventory listing. That was entertaining. Pretty much the only thing worth saving was the engine in your now departed van. Though I wonder if you get a package deal if you buy the canal boat and the Ssangyong.

duurtlang > someassemblyrequired 09/02/2016 at 18:35

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If you want both of those boats I bet you can convince him into including that green Suzuki/Maruti Alto you can see through the window of my van in the above picture.

Or maybe this 2001 Ram Van with a manual and a turbo diesel for €600. Note that I managed to haggle 45% off the asking price of the Lancia (was €799, got it for €450).

duurtlang > RT 09/02/2016 at 18:39

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I’ve got a friendly mechanic who’s going to do the bulk of the work. In his (very large) shed. I’ll help him out if he needs my help. I’m far to inexperienced to do (and plan) such a thing myself.

I’ll get me an engine mount from a 306/405/ZX/Xsara/Xantia with a specific engine tomorrow, at a junk yard. Plus a some 205 radiator hoses and another part. I will need a 205 turbo diesel transmission as well, as the gearing in the 1.6 GTi box is way too short for the turbo engine.

RT > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 18:46

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Sounds good, I hope it goes well.

someassemblyrequired > duurtlang 09/02/2016 at 19:18

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It’ll be a poor sucker that ends up with those. The Alto is probably the only one worth having. The Ram Van is at least a manual diesel, but you can almost smell the nasty interior through the internet.